Interview of Northwest Airlines stewardess re Flight 305 hijacking (PH 164-133)
Document date 3 December 1971
Also filed at: Part 110 pp. 50–57
Copies may differ in what was redacted.
Also filed separately as sections:
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Id: Cooper-Part-64:159-166
Subject: Cooper Files: Cooper-Part-64:159-166 Document: FD-302 interview of Northwest Airlines stewardess re Flight 305 hijacking (PH 164-133) Id: Cooper-Part-64:159-166 Page: https://cooper.theunsolved.net/documents/Cooper-Part-64%3A159-166 What is wrong (title, date, type, which pages belong together, copies)? What does the scan show?
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FBI 164-81, Vault Part 64 pp. 159–166 (DB Cooper-26973–26980), FD-302 interview, dated 3 Dec 1971 — cooper.theunsolved.net/documents/Cooper-Part-64%3A159-166
FEDERAL BUREAU OF INVESTIGATION
Date December 3, 1971
[REDACTED], residing at the home of [REDACTED] provided the following information:
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On November 24, 1971, while employed as a stewardess for Northwest Airlines, she flew on Flight 305 which originated in Washington, D. C., arrived at Minneapolis, Minn., about 10 a.m., and she boarded shortly thereafter. She said the crew for her flight were Pilot WILLIAM SCOTT, | Senior Stewardess B Stewardess [REDACTED] |, and C Stewardess
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[REDACTED] advised that her flight departed Minneapolis, Minn., at 10:35 Central Standard Time, with a light load, less than half, and flew to Great Falls, Montana, then to Missoula, Montana, then to Spokane, Washington, and Portland, Oregon. She said that the aircraft departed Portland, Oregon at 2:53 Pacific Time, and arrived two hours and fifty-three minutes later at Seattle which is normally a 36 minute flight.
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Just before the [REDACTED] gave the word for take off from Portland, [REDACTED] took a beverage form to the aft jump seat. There was a man in seat 18 E, middle right aft passenger seat, and as she, [REDACTED], faced the barrier strip, she observed [REDACTED] dropping a note, stand up, and unfasten the barrier strip and sit down next to the man in seat 18 E. [REDACTED] appeared emotional in that she was trying to speak to her, was moving her lips, but other than [REDACTED] no other words came out.
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[REDACTED] picked up the note lying at her feet and read it which, to the best of her recollection, is as follows:
"Miss, I am hijacking this plane. I have a bomb. Sit next to me."
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The aircraft lifted off the runway at 2:58 and [REDACTED] used the interphone to advise the pilot the ship was being
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On 12/1-2/71 [REDACTED] File # Philadelphia 164-133 SA [REDACTED] /[illegible] by SA [REDACTED] JWC/lss Date dictated 12/[illegible]/71
This document contains neither recommendations nor conclusions of the FBI. It is the property of the FBI and is loaned to your agency; it and its contents are not to be distributed outside your agency.
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DB Cooper-26973
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b6 b7C
PH 164-133 .2
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hijacked. She said, "We're being hijacked, he's got a bomb and this is no joke." She replaced the phone and leaned down in the isle near [REDACTED] and saw her writing something on an en- velope. After [REDACTED] finished writing, she said to the man next to her that she would take the note to the cockpit. [REDACTED] asked [REDACTED] if she wanted her to take the note and she said no. [REDACTED] said, "Do you want me to stay here?" and the man replied, "yes." [REDACTED] took the note and entered the cockpit.
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[REDACTED] sat next to the man and shortly thereafter he opened a black cheap appearing imitation leather attache case and showed her a device with eight red cylinders and a wire running from the cylinders towards a large 6" x 8" x 2" in diameter battery. The wire had a red plastic coating around it, all with the exception of the last inch which was bare and which the man held in between his fingers. He told her it was an electronic device and suggested the aircraft radio be used as little as possible. He said he didn't think radio transmissions would bother it, but wanted to let the crew know.
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She then called the pilot over the interphone and ad- vised him of the device and from that point on she acted as a communications media between the hijacker and the pilot through the interphone. During one message to the pilot, he specified that all of the previous requested items be at the airport when they landed. She later learned that the note which [REDACTED] had carried to the pilot contained a list of demands. He later told [REDACTED] that he wanted $200,000 in circulated U. S. currency, two back and two front parachutes, and fuel trucks to meet the plane when it landed at Seattle. One of the specific demands that he made was that the fuel truck is to come first and start fueling the plane immediately. Everyone in the plane was to remain in their seat and he indicated that [REDACTED] was to be a liaison and the one to get the money. After fueling is completed and the money is aboard, he indicated that the passengers would be re- leased, and the last item to be brought aboard the aircraft would be the chutes, and at that time only the crew members were to be aboard and they must stay out of the isle and remain in their seats.
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During the flight from Portland to Seattle, she had light conversation with the hijacker. For example, she asked him where he was from and he became upset and said he didn't want to answer that. She somehow brought up that they would be going to Cuba and mentioned that personnel were advised to warn passengers against buying any Cuban rum or cigars because U. S. Customs would confiscate them when they returned to the United States.
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DB Cooper-26974
PH 164-133 3
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The hijacker laughed and said that they weren't going to Cuba, but that she would like where they were going. He asked her where she was from and she told him that she was from Pennsylvania, but was living in Minneapolis, Minn. He indicated that Minneapolis, Minn., was very nice country.
She asked him why he picked Northwest Airlines to hijack and he laughed and said, "It's not because I have a grudge against your airlines, it's just because I have a grudge." He paused and said that the flight suited his time, place, and plans. Other conversation centered around personal habits such as smoking and he asked her if she did and she said she used to but had quit and he offered her a cigarette which she took and smoked. She asked if he wanted any food or drink and he refused everything.
During the flight from Portland to Seattle, a male customer started aft down the isle and she met him at ap- proximately Row 14 where she asked him what he wanted and he indicated he was looking for a sports magazine. They went to the aft section of the plane immediately behind the hijacker where they looked and finally he accepted a New Yorker Magazine and returned to his seat. After he was seated and[ ] returned b6 to seat 18 D, next to the hijacker, he said, "If that is a Sky b7c Marshal I don't want any more of that," and she reassured him that it wasn't and further, that there were no sky marshals on that flight.
A short while after that, the pilot called her and asked her to determine from the hijacker if he wanted the pilot to inform the passengers of the situation, and the hijacker said, "no." The pilot said that he would make up another excuse to cover the extension of the flight way beyond the normal 36 minutes. It was at this point the hijacker instructed her to tell the pilot that he wanted the note and envelope back that he had given to the other stewardess. He also wanted the empty matchbook cover from which he had been lighting his cigarettes and had thrown into the back pouch of the seat in front as she said she would normally do with trash. She indicated that he had another book of matches the cover of which was blue and said,"Sky Chef," from which she had pulled matches to light his cigarettes. He retained this book of matches.
The hijacker made a comment while the aircraft was in a holding pattern north of the airport that it is 5:15 and he is still waiting, and this is something that he had wanted by 5 p.m. She called the pilot on the phone and he said that they were waiting for the front pack chutes to arrive at the
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DB Cooper-26975
PH 164-133
¢
airport from Mc Cord. The hijacker said, "Mc Cord is only 20 minutes from Tacoma; it doesn't take that long." She called the cockpit back over the interphone and they said that the chutes were en route and the cockpit requested per- mission from the hijacker to start their descent without the chutes being present at the airport. The hijacker said yes, provided they don't have to wait for the chutes after the fueling was completed. A few minutes later, the pilot called [ ] back on the interphone and advised the chutes were there and he was going down.
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The flight landed at Seattle International Airport at 5:46 Pacific time. Prior to landing, the captain wanted permission from the hijacker to park his aircraft away from the terminal and the hijacker said okay. The pilot said he would park the aircraft in a semi-lighted runway not being used and this pleased the hijacker. While the aircraft was being taxied to the area at which the aircraft would be parked, she asked the hijacker's permission to move five passengers away from the immediate area of his seat which he approved of and she did.
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Stewardess [ ] stood at Row 15 in the middle of the isle to be certain that no one came aft. When the air- craft stopped, the pilot got permission from the hijacker to let the fuel trucks approach the plane and begin refueling. The truck stairs came to the front door and [ ] left by way of the front door, went to a car carrying the money, chutes, food, maps, and radio for cockpit communications. At this point, he got up with the attache case and headed towards the aft lavatory. When she returned, he was back in his seat. She dragged a white canvas money bag down the isle to where the hijacker was sitting and placed it on seat 18 D next to him. He looked through the bag and said that it was alright for the passengers to get off the plane. [ ] phoned the pilot and told him and he told the passengers over the intercom system that they could leave the aircraft.
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After the passengers left, she asked if he wanted her to get other items and he said yes but wanted the other - crew members to remain seated. She first brought in the big parachute and he told her to pull the window shades which she did. She then went and brought back the small chutes and carried them on the ship. Her next trip she got the big chute and placed it with the others on Row 18. At this point, she gave him a paper shout giving instructions on how to jump and he said he didn't need that. Prior to this, she asked the hijacker if
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DB Cooper-26976
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b6 b7C b6 b7C
PH 164-133
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he wouldn't rather have one of the cockpit crew get the chutes and he told her that they weren't that heavy and she wouldn't have any trouble.
When she returned to the plane with the last chute, she saw he had one chute cut open and nylon cords out and he was cutting them with his pocket knife. He took the nylon cord and wrapped it around the neck of the money bag numerous times and then he wrapped it a few times from top to bottom, and with the same piece made a loop like a handle at the top. This nylon cord was pinkish in color. He appeared irritated because they didn't give him a knapsack for the money which he had initially requested, and after trying to put the money in an unfolded parachute, he decided to leave it in the can- vas bag.
She told him that they had crew meals and maps, and requested permission to go get them. He said, "yes," and she did, returning the items and taking a seat next to him.
He said, "We're going to Mexico City, gear down, flaps down, you can trim the flaps to 15, you can stop any- where in Mexico to refuel, but nowhere in the United States. The aft door must be open and the stairs to be down. The altitude under 10,000 feet, they know they can't go over that. Cabin lights out and everyone is to be forward of the first class curtain." [REDACTED] related these instructions to the pilot. [REDACTED] came back to where the hijacker was seated and asked if she could get her purse and he said that she should come on back, he wouldn't bite her. Then she asked if the stewardesses could get off and he said, "yes."
About one hour had passed since landing, and [REDACTED] was taking information for the hijacker from the pilot and she told the other stewardesses to go ahead and she would be with them in a second and they went forward to the cockpit. She told the hijacker that the plane couldn't take off with the ladder down and he said in a low tone, "Yes they can, but the cockpit can put it down after they get airborne. She told him that the stairs had to be let down from the rear and at this point he appeared disturbed because of the duration of time of refueling and he told her to stay.
Just prior to take off, he became very excited be- cause they had been on the ground over an hour and she related this to the cockpit and they answered that they had only 1500 pounds of fuel to be put on and this was about one quarter of their capacity. She explained this to him and he calmed down.
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DB Cooper-26977
PH 164-133 6
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She then told him it would be a few minutes longer while they filed a flight plan and he said, "Never mind, they can do that over the radio once we get up. Let's get the show on the road."
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The cockpit called and told her to use the escape rope to secure herself when they found out that she was going to lower the ladder once the aircraft is airborne. She related this to the hijacker and he said, "no," he didn't want her to go up front or them to come back. She asked if the second of- ficer could shut the front door and he said yes. She opened the aft door and locked it open and the pilot started the en- gines and taxied towards the runway. During the taxi, she said, "You know we have oxygen, and he said, "Yes, I know where it is,if I need it I will get it." She asked him to cut some nylon cord from the parachute for her to use as a safety line when she opened the rear ladder and the hijacker said, "Never mind," that he would do it. She showed him where the panel was and the controls and how to do it, and reminded him to be sure to put the ladder up before they land or the aircraft would be so damaged in landing that it could not take off again. She returned to seat 18 C, he to 18 E, the money was in 18 D, and the bomb in 18 F. The plane took off and she held her ears because the noise was so loud from the engines. Approximately four minutes after take off, he stood up, told her to go to the cockpit and close the first class curtains, and for no one to come out from behind the curtains. The lights were out in the rear compartment and she went forward, faced the curtain, and the last time she saw him he had a nylon cord tied around his waist and was standing in the isle. Before she finished securing the curtain, she pleaded with him to take the bomb with him and he said he would take it with him or disarm it before he leaves.
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After securing the curtain, she entered the cockpit and approximately ten minutes after that, one of the officers re- ceived an interphone call from the hijacker advising that he could not get the rear stairs down. The pilot informed him that he would level the craft off and reduce the air speed. She recalls that a short time after that, she observed the red indicator light go on the second officer's panel indicating that the stairs had been lowered and approximately five minutes after the first call, one of the officers received another call from the hijacker which was the last communication that anyone in the plane had with the hijacker.
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Before descending at Reno, Nev., she called re- peatedly over the intercom system to the hijacker to cooperate, that the aircraft must land. The last message was, "Sir, we are going to land now, please put up the stairs. We are going to land anyway, but the aircraft may be structurally damaged and
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DB Cooper-26978
PH 164-133
7
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we may not be able to take off after we've landed." The pilot landed the aircraft and parked it away from the terminal. She and the pilot entered the cabin and he called to the hijacker a number of times to cooperate and asked for instructions. When they received no answer, they went behind the curtain. She went to the galley, did not see the man, and simultaneously flipped on all of the cabin lights and there was no one there. The captain and her ran to the rear of the ship and they looked for the bomb. She looked in the aft lavatory and checked the oxygen bussels, then began crawling up the isle looking under seats for the bomb. While she was doing this, the first officer was coming down the isle from the cockpit on his knees with a flashlight looking under the seats for the bomb. After a few minutes, the co-pilot told her to get off of the ship which she did. She walked two blue lights down the taxiway away from the aircraft. It was dark. She recalls that upon entering the aft section of the ship, she observed the one chute that had been cut open and another chute. One was on Row 17, the other on Row 18, both left side of ship.
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She said that about five minutes after she left the aircraft, three cars came to the nose of the plane.
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[redacted] described the hijacker as follows:
Sex Male Race White Age 44-46 Height 6' Weight 180-190 pounds Complexion Medium to dark Build Medium Hair Dark, flat, straight, sideburns narrow, mid ear Eyes Not observed Characteristics Wore sunglasses, dark plastic wrap-around frames.
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The man impressed her as being an executive by his dress, special mannerisms, and consideration that he exhibited for her while he was on the aircraft.
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The only time she can recall any actual threat to her life was during the flight from Portland to Seattle he mentioned to her to impress upon everybody that the device he had he would use, that he would not be taken off of the plane. She could not detect an accent in his voice.
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DB Cooper-26979
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b6 b7c
PH 164-133 8
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Clothing Dark brown suit, possibly with a thin black stripe, brown socks, brown ankle length pebble grain shoes, not tie type shoes.
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She did not have recollection of any rings or unusual facial scars, marks, or tattoos.
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[REDACTED] advised that her recollection of the flight from the Seattle International Airport was that the weather was extremely murky and that the ground could not be seen.
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b6 b7C
DB Cooper-26980
Serials: PH 164-133